Franchise Pick

59 opinions for IS PLAY N TRADE A GREAT FRANCHISE OPPORTUNITY?

• IS PLAY N TRADE A GREAT FRANCHISE OPPORTUNITY? at PIGASYS
  Jan 26, 2008 at 11:48 am

  […] Share This […]

• michael webster
  Jan 26, 2008 at 8:49 pm

  Uh, it is a piece of poo.

  Why not franchise downloading music CD’s and trading them?

  Both are equally stupid business plans.

• Chris
  Mar 6, 2008 at 10:02 am

  without a doubt it is a great investment. Just look at the growth the industry has been experiencing. If you have ever been into one of their stores you would know what all the buzz is about. As far as Michael’s comment, it makes no sense…..Video games are not moving towards the downloadable market. Any company that thinks this is a good idea is just opening up the door to piracy and these large companies such as Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo know what they are doing by making the games bigger and better and comstantly coming out with new platforms. There is a reason Play n Tade is growing like they are…it’s a successful model

• michael webster aka dumb dumb
  Mar 29, 2008 at 7:11 am

  michael webster is an idiot who needs to get a life and learn about running a business. just because you shop there doesnt mean you know the industry…dumb ass

• sean
  Mar 29, 2008 at 7:44 am

  I don’t think Michael Webster said he shopped there. I think he said it is “a piece of poo.”

  The business model is more like Play it Again Sports, CD Xchange, or Little Professor Bookshops, right? You can buy new stuff, but also trade in your old stuff?

  Or a lot like Blockbuster, in that you have to buy and sell a perishable media property and not get stuck with outdated inventory?

  Michael may be referring to the problem Blockbuster franchisees faced when the franchisor started offering Netflix type services to the dismay of its franchisees.

• Michael Webster
  Mar 29, 2008 at 7:46 am

  Here is the 2007 financials.

  http://134.186.208.228/caleasi/PDFDocs/004788513.PDF

  Let’s see 30 stores generating 80k in royalties or less than 3k per store.

  Assume 1/2 stores open in 2006, so double the 3k to 6k. At a 4% royalty rate - geez, these guys are making money had over fist.

• sean
  Mar 29, 2008 at 7:48 am

  michael webster aka dumb dumb:

  Another thought: Webster’s Canadian. Up there “piece of poo” may actually be a term of endearment.

• Michael Webster
  Mar 29, 2008 at 7:51 am

  No Sean, the phrase is used in its universal sense.

• sean
  Mar 29, 2008 at 7:56 am

  Michael Webster obviously fails to appreciate that there is more to a business than simply revenue and profitability.
  Sometimes lifestyle and perks are so great they overcome dismal economics.
  Perk: Free video games!
  Lifestyle: The ability to hang out with gamers at the mall!

• Michael Webster
  Mar 29, 2008 at 8:01 am

  Sean, I admit to the failure to appreciate the fine points of bankruptcy.

• Matt
  Apr 2, 2008 at 3:57 pm

  Mr. Michael seems to know a lot about business and numbers.

  1. Michael those are not 2007 financials they are the 2006 numbers.
  2. Play N Trade only had 13 open stores in June of 2006.
  3. Royalties for those open stores (first generation stores) were at 3% or lower.
  4. Some did not pay royalties (crappy early agreements).
  5. If you want to do real research call the stores and ask them how much they are making. All numbers and address of the 140 open stores are here http://playntrade.com/locations/

  Don’t believe the hype bro!

  No franchise has the secret sauce. You must work, advertise, manage and invest in your business. If you think you can turn on an a “Open” sign and business comes pouring in. . .then you have been misled.

  All businesses, with no exceptions take hard work, effort and money for them to be profitable.

  Why I like this biz: In the “buy sell trade” world of gaming there is only one main competitor: Game Stop/EB Games. It’s like there is only one Burger Joint or only one tanning place. Find me another business that has as low distribution numbers for an industry that grew the most out of any retail sector in the USA.

  Simply type in “Video game store” in Yellow pages for San Francisco, or Orlando, or Portland and see how many pages of listings you come up with. Then do the same thing for “Hair cut” or “Burger” or “Tanning” or “Gym” and then see how many listings show up. You will see my point very quickly. (Hint: the video game search will produce 1/4 the listings than any other search will).

  Don’t take my words do the research. Call the stores. Think about what you want in life and how you want to live it. Working retail is very hard and frustrating. Owning a great retail store can also be very rewarding in many ways.

  Choose wisely and do your freaking homework!

• michael webster
  Apr 2, 2008 at 6:38 pm

  Matt:

  How would anyone know be reviewing the 2007 UFOC that only 13 stores were opened in 2006?

• Can You Make Money with a Play N Trade Video Game Franchise? | PIGASYS
  Apr 10, 2008 at 7:11 pm

  […] You can read the rest of thread about Play N Trade at Franchise Pick. […]

• Steve
  Jun 16, 2008 at 6:24 pm

  First let me tell you that I have done my homework and I can tell you that I just recently got into this franchise and one thing is that yes I heard of how great this franchise is and how well everyone is doing not just from Play N Trade but also from store owners. But now try asking anyone and you get this whole different story, yes the giant Gamespot has no direct competition but at the same time they still control and will continue to control the market, at least until the day that shoppers decide to support their small local business such as a Play N Trade Franchisee, keeping their money to be spent in their local communities. But one thing is that there seems to be alot of troubles with the Play N Trade stores now when you ask the store owners how they are doing they give a whole different story than what I used to get three months ago before I got into this franchise. And yes there are many store that are closing due to no profit and lack of support and stability at the corporate level of Play N Trade. There seems to be more things wrong that good and yes we all should be smart enough that you do not expect to just open the doors to any type of store and expect to be swimming in money, they do take alot of work but when you see the stores that have been open for quite some time and their top retailing stores still not being abe to turn positive than there is a problem. There is no distribution system as Gamestop has, as a matter of fact you got franchisee’s buying inventories from competitors such as Best Buy, Costco even Gamespot to sell to their customers due to the lack of negotiation power they have with vendors and the game publishers. I could go on for a long time over many things that are wrong about this Franchise but with me doing my homework I only got a bunch of lies and all I get now is a sorry from these franchisee’s telling me they only said that things were great due to fear from the franchisor that has obviously grown faster than what they were prepared for. Heck you even got people that were part of their corporate team launching their own video game franchise system.

• sean
  Jun 16, 2008 at 8:46 pm

  Steve:
  Were the people who gave you the positive recommendations area developers or area representatives?
  Are you a master or an individual franchise owner?

• marty
  Jun 18, 2008 at 8:33 am

  Steve,
  Don’t lie to people just because your lazy and don’t follow the PNT system. They have great relationships with the biggest distributors out there. If your not happy, sell your store to someone who loves video games and isn’t afraid to work, so that you don’t hurt the rest of the system.

• Greg
  Jun 18, 2008 at 9:38 pm

  I inquired about PnT but chose not to purchase. I sat on the con calls, spoke with the President but nobody can give any specifics regarding digital distribution. As broadban increases within the US, consoles will offer more and more downloadable content. Heck, you can do a LOT of it now. Developers continue to complain about making games for multiple consoles and PC’s. The president of Sony also said that he would be shocked if the PS4 had a disk drive. Nobody believed the music industry would let people download stuff right to their computers, why do you think consoles will be any different? Will it happen tomorrow? No, but it most likely will. I am not willing to sink my hard earned money into a 50/50 chance of my biz model becoming irrelevant overnight.

  I sold my shares of Gamestop in the $60’s due to this possible problem.

• Anthony
  Jul 7, 2008 at 1:40 pm

  Greg,

  I’ve also inquired about Play N Trade and am 100% on the fence but leaning more towards not going with them. You are paying only for the name which does not carry much weight right now. The business model itself is good and I have personally visited 3 locations in my state but since they are all new I think I’ll hold off on the final yes or no until next year to see how profitbale they are. One of the locations is killing it right now after only 3 weeks but I want to see where they are after 52 weeks.

  I highly doubt that the video game industry will ever been 100% downloadable. As the games become more and more complex they also require more and more memory. Developers will continue to complain about making games for multiple platforms but multiple platforms equals competition. Can you ever see Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft merging to create a single use platform for all video games? I feel it’s highly unlikely.

• greg
  Jul 9, 2008 at 7:00 am

  Anthony,

  I also dont believe video games will become 100% downloadable. However, I believe its in the best interest of game developers to strive for a single format. Think about all the money companies like Sony, Nintendo can save by closing all of their factories. They can save on the game boxes, plastic, cd’s etc. They could also cut massive employee overhead. Also, this does not mean the companies need to consolidate, they simply have to agree on a downloadable format which they can all use.

  I like the idea of P N T, and I think you can make money with them. I just worry that the next generation consoles may damage the current business model.

  I invest in oil and do not see demand destruction in the near future (2-5 years). If given the choice to download a cheaper game via my console, or get in my car and drive to the store, I will choose downloading everytime.

  Downloading the game will most likey be cheaper (less overhead for the companies to pass on) hence returning a game to P N T becomes irrelevant if you’re getting the game cheaper from the start. I used to take games over to a friends house, but I am in my late 20s and that is something I no longer do, so that fact the game can only be played on my console does not bother me (I could always bring my console over…). Given the fact the average gamer is in his 30’s, I have to assume other 30 year olds arent hanging out gaming with each other (this is just my opinion).

  Also, I am surprised that gamers still return games to stores. I simply sell my used games on eBay for a much better return…

  The above are my reasons for not purchasing P N T rights. The decision is different for everyone.

  Greg

• john
  Jul 13, 2008 at 12:49 am

  I personally know that these stores are not good investments. I am an owner of a store in CA and much of the info they tell you is hype. stay away from this franchise.

• marty
  Jul 13, 2008 at 12:37 pm

  I personally own 3 of them and it is the best investment I have ever made. If you find away to fail at this, your just a loser that would fail at anything. Just look at gamestop’s financials then decide if you can out sell an 18 year old on minimum wage. If you say no, stay at your dead end job or you will end up like john.

• Sophie
  Jul 25, 2008 at 6:41 am

  If you are doing so well, maybe instead of being an asshole and insulting people you could offer a few helpful tips

  There are many stores in the franchise that are struggling and more are closing every day. My own store is on the verge of closing. We have to dip into our own pockets to pay our rent every month. We have reached out to headqarters for help on many occasions and we have yet to get any actual helpful advice besides them telling us to give away free things like tshirts that cost me $18 each.

  We adressed an issue on a con call once about the fact that when we sell a console we LOSE money. And their only answer was that “well then let Best Buy take the loss on the console” What kind of answer is that? So when someone comes in looking for a console I’m supposed to tell them to go to ANOTHER STORE? Why would they ever come back to my store after that? I can’t offer any discount on my games since we only have a $3 markup on them to begin with.

  5 out of the 15 owners who were in basic training with me have already closed their stores and this is in less than a YEAR! But why does corporate care about failing stores when the owner already has his multi-million dollar beach house in Newport Beach

• marty
  Jul 25, 2008 at 8:26 am

  Again,
  Read above about loser. Winner’s have beach houses, losers look for websites to complain on instead of working harder.

• Chris
  Jul 25, 2008 at 11:42 am

  Sophie- Not to single you out…Support from Corporate is key, sounds like they have let you down a bit. I like the concept of PnT but I’m told they provide proprietary software for managing merchandise and POS. Why don’t you identify what sells and doesn’t sell and get rid of the poor selling stuff, the systems provided should be able to do this for you with reports…If you lose money on a console (how is that possible?) use the system to figure out why? Is it an effective system at all?

• marty
  Jul 26, 2008 at 8:11 am

  Chris,
  I’ve had 3 other franchises and PNT support is the best by far. Some people just aren’t cut out to own their own business. And with every concept, instead of pointing the finger at themselves, they look for someone else to blame.

• Chris
  Jul 26, 2008 at 9:10 am

  Marty,
  I agree with you on that. But, like I said if she had adequate training with the system, from corporate, perhaps that would help her. I’m not familiar with the systems you folks are using but I know being a bit technical, that POS is like the smart employee that always wants to help and doesn’t take butt breaks. Have not heard back from her…Do you think the POS is adequate? If so, maybe give her some advice. It will be important to me to know this(before making any commits as a 1 person owner)as I research PnT and a couple other franchise opportunities. Take care.

• marty
  Jul 26, 2008 at 4:35 pm

  I would defer to the franchisees I know that came from GameStop. They say the PNT POS is by far better than that giant company. My managers learned in one day from the on-line training tutorials.

• Sophie's partner
  Jul 28, 2008 at 8:53 am

  Support from PnT? HA! To this date all we’ve gotten from them is an over-priced bunch of fixtures and an equally overpriced POS that doesn’t do anything very well at all. We have asked for support and just get the same answers back…”hold tournaments and give out swag” We already hold tournaments on a regular basis and the ahve gotten popular, but who cares if there’s 35 people in the store playing since no one’s buying and the swag they recomend for us is too damn expensive fr us to just give it away anymore. We tell them we’re almost out of money and rather then give us some real ideas they tell us to spend what we don’t have.

  As for losing consoles, our suppliers (since corporae won’t negotiate for lower prices or d what other franchises do and buy a huge amount to get a bulk discount and then sell them to us) sell us the consoles usually at Retail. Add in the credit card fees since it’s pretty rare and a bit suspicious for someone to buy a $400+ system with cash. Add to tha the franchise taking their cut in their fees (even though they don’t do a thing to earn it)

  To anyone looking for a franchise I say this: STAY AWAY FROM PnT! Don’t fall or their gimicks and the claims that there is a fortune to be made in this industry. There may very well be for them, but it is on our backs. For every successful PnT store there are many of us struggling just to stay open, owners working 80 hours a week, losing their homes, their credit and their marriage to this beast. As I look back I really wish I’d just put the $250,000 this has cost us into a big pile and lit a match. At least then I’d have gotten something out of it…the fire would have been pretty to watch.

• marty
  Jul 28, 2008 at 6:51 pm

  She’s right,
  If your a pathetic loser, don’t invest in PNT, or any other franchise. I’ve been with 3 other franchises and PNT’s support is the best out there.(cold stone, fire house and curves).Look at Gamestops earnings claims then make your own decision, then ask am I a winner or a loser, then get in or stay out.

• Chris
  Jul 28, 2008 at 11:08 pm

  Sophie’s Partner - It sounds like you are pretty disappointed to say the least. I think your idea for corp to buy in bulk was solid, ever consider writing them a letter to introduce the thought? The POS is not that huh? Are you allowed “go manual” or invest in a new system? 250k is a big investment. What % was the POS and Inv? I would think that they could re-train you…Can you perform trade-ins quickly or pull customer lists for programs…Any thing to make that part easier as you manage your budget dollars. Just a thought.

  C-

• Chris
  Jul 28, 2008 at 11:18 pm

  Marty,
  Question-Does the support stem from Corporate or area developers? I was thinking about how you and Sophie (and partner) are polar opposites. It does not make sense…

  -C

• marty
  Jul 29, 2008 at 7:34 am

  The difference is I owned businesses before and they haven’t. Alot of these types of franchisees are used to having it all given to them with little effort on their part. The support comes from both corporate (assigned support specialist and A.D’s if one is in our region. I don’t have an AD and really don’t see the need. Corporate also has a traveling in-store support group. The founder of the company actually came to my region and trained me and my staff personaly! Tell me subway or anyone else does that.

• Chris
  Jul 29, 2008 at 9:43 am

  Marty, Sophie,
  How long have you each owned a PnT? Is/was there a ramp-up time… It sounds like the support comes from 2 different companies… Sounds like you both work hard with varying results… Marty, what is the easiest was to summons corp support? Thanks to both of you for the real scoop.

• Sophie
  Jul 29, 2008 at 1:23 pm

  It’s not hard to find the info. For every successful PNT, 5 of them struggle and close.

  Corporate is very quick to offer help and support if your store is in California by their headquarters. But my store is on the other side of the country and despite several requests they refuse to have someone fly out to help us.

• marty
  Jul 29, 2008 at 1:51 pm

  Do you really think they would be selling/opening so many stores with a 1/5 ratio? Come on, look in the mirror and sell your store. List it on Bizbuysell.com tommorow. You’re just not cut out for your own business. No franchise is required to fly out to help you, but they still try to visit the stores as much as possible. I’m done with this exchange, it’s for whiners.

• Chris
  Jul 29, 2008 at 5:32 pm

  Sophie, thanks for the info, hope it all works out for you whether you get the support you need from corporate or cut your losses and and find a franchise that puts a smile on your face.
  C-

• Chris
  Jul 29, 2008 at 6:12 pm

  Marty,

  Though I appreciate your words of wisdom, you should probably watch your tone, you stand the risk of sounding a bit arrogant. Lets recap;
  - You mentioned earlier you’ve owned 3 other franchises, this being your 4th. How did the first, second or third one go for you?
  - Unless you still own any of the other 3, we can assume they didn’t go as planned?
  - For you to tell someone they are not cut out to run or own their business seems a bit off to me, 4 stores later.
  - You also mentioned the founder of the business trained you personally…No argument there.
  - Seems easy to say that the support is great when the founder of the company travelled to your location…
  * Perhaps if Sophie (and partner) had 3 times the experience (learning from passed endeavors) I won’t call your first 3 attempts failures because most of the millionaires out there went through several trials to reach success. It’s about never giving up right? Not just quitting if the first attempt lets you down… In addition, if Sophie (and partner) received the same level of corporate support, i.e. trained by the founder…they may not have the angst. Thanks again for the insight, but based on your own angst and apparent self doubt, I’m happy to end this exchange. Not really up for any kind of discussion with the corporate puppet.

  Semper Fi-

• oscar
  Aug 3, 2008 at 10:33 am

  Marty, I have been looking into buying a PNT franchise also and would like to know your view on selling consoles and new games. If you are not buying consoles at a discount, and the new games are only marked up $3 dollars, where is the bulk of the revenue coming from. If your answer is only used games, then how many could you possibly be selling per day to hit your goals? Even at $15 profit per game and an average sale of 40/day you are only bringing in $18,000 a month. Minus 4% royalties and 1% marketing you are left with $17,100. After rent and salary I dont see much more than some gas money. So again, your experience and Sophie’s are polar opposites, yet Sophie is giving us concrete answers while you are using a “smoke and mirrors” technique. Can you give us anything factual? Lastly, you cannot compare PNT to EB or Gamestop as they actually make some kind of profit on both consoles and new games. Note the fact that as they are not a franchise 5% of their overhead is not going to an override. Please give an educated response as we are genuinely interested in PNT. Thank you in advance.

• dale
  Aug 10, 2008 at 10:30 am

  Sophie & Partner,
  I am so sorry Marty was so hateful to you. I will graduate with my MBA in 6 days and my thesis is on Play N Trade. My professor has his PH.D. in management and we have been working on the PNT UFOC and financials for 4 months. I called corporate for information and researched everything I could find. The Play N Trade I went to did not have a play before you buy policy because the owner needed batteries for the game stations and he could not afford to buy them. He told me, a potential customer, that he was losing money. I felt so sorry for him I asked it I could buy a Wii but he did not have one in stock. As I looked around the store, “Out of Stock” signs were everywhere. I went to another store and had a similar experience and at the third store the owner tried to sell it to me.

  I have a co-worker opening a Play N Trade. I wish she had not bought the hype. I have heard it as well and it is good hype but unrealistic.
  My professor told me to tell my friend to “get out if she can.” It is not your business skills effecting your business. I have to defend my thesis and we can not even find a way to make the organization work. When I presented the company to my professor I thought it was great and he just smiled and said, “Let’s see how you feel at the end of the semester.” He was right.
  Best Wishes

• marty
  Aug 10, 2008 at 4:39 pm

  Dale,
  You are full of shi_. Does the M in MBA stand for Moron? What batteries are you talking about? You’re obviously a fake. And if you are in school, stay there. You will never make it by making decisions the way you do.

• michael webster
  Aug 10, 2008 at 5:39 pm

  Marty, you are shill. Please be quiet.

  Dale, where are you doing your MBA? Who is your thesis supervisor.

• oscar
  Aug 11, 2008 at 4:35 pm

  Marty, can you answer my question? I have yet to see a response other than flaming people.

• Derek
  Aug 19, 2008 at 12:22 pm

  one of my co-workers opened a PNT about a year ago, and many of the above stories (good and bad) are very true. My co-worker and wife work ed many hours without pay. The store is now in great shape and self contained. Problems rose and they sacraficed and overcome and now have a staff to attend to the shop. I hope the best for all PNT new and old franchies. GAME ON

• Derek
  Aug 19, 2008 at 12:24 pm

  one of my co-workers opened a PNT about a year ago, and many of the above stories (good and bad) are very true. My co-worker and wife work ed many hours without pay. The store is now in great shape and self contained. Problems rose and they sacrificed and overcome and now have a staff to attend to the shop. I hope the best for all PNT new and old franchise. GAME ON

• Johnney
  Aug 20, 2008 at 7:59 am

  It is amazing to see how much time Sophia has to complain on a message board…shouldn’t you be focusing on your business. Doesn’t it benefit Play N Trade for you to be profitable? Seems to me that there are alot of owners in the system that haven’t even been open for a year. Correct me if I am wrong but it should take a year before you start to make money. As far as new games and consoles I heard that manufacturers barely make anything on the consoles and new games are low margin items for all video game retailers. Play N Trade has so much more than all these other stores. I know when I shop for games I only buy used….such a better deal. I love the PNT concept and see nothing but good things for the company and the franchisees that are able to grasp the concept. Small business is never easy and you really have to put your blood, sweat, and tears into it.

• Jeff
  Aug 24, 2008 at 9:21 am

  I would like to know, of the PnT owners that are watching and interacting on this thread, how many of you had an interest in video games when you went into this business? Are you/do you actively pay attention to the gaming market and know what games are coming up, the hype surrounding them and the innovations that they may bring or do you let PnT feed you the information via their internal networks?

• Neil
  Aug 29, 2008 at 9:35 am

  I have notice that alot of the owners of the PnT franchise in here aren’t really gamers. Looks like people who think, since the gaming industry is getting so popular why not grab the market when its hot. To be able to sale games you have to be into games your self. You have to have the experience of games likes most customers that would come to a game store. I have been to Gamestop/ebgames, some of the reps there know nothing of games, just to make quick buck cause their parents want them to find a job. Play the games, really take a dive into the gaming industry.

  Just before people start flaming me, I come from a gaming back ground. My brother in law owns a gaming cafe. I worked for the gaming industry for 3 years, i have been playing games for as long as i can remember.

  I believe to make this buisness go well, like how most of you wish it did. You have to know what you are selling, and to whom you are selling to.

  Best of LUCK to PnT owners. Dont give up. You have to plant the seed and sacrifice time before you get to see the tree.

• sean
  Aug 29, 2008 at 10:39 am

  Neil:
  It’s an interesting point - whether it helps or hurts to be an owner/gamer. Certainly the staff needs to be knowledgeable and passionate about video games, but isn’t it more important for a business owner to know how to run a business than how to get Mario to jump barrels and collect gold coins?

• Neil
  Aug 29, 2008 at 11:11 am

  Sean:
  I agree, and sorry for leaving that out. Kind of did that post in a rush. Yes, i agree about the part about knowing how to run a buisness also. And i also didn’t mean by knowing how to play the game, I meant knowing the gaming industry, and understanding what a customer needs or wants by relating to their experiences. Like when selling a car, you have to know the car, you have to understand the customers needs. You need some passion in an industry to really make money in that industry. I know a PnT owner in my area, and he wants to sell his store, do you know what he told me. He said he hates retail buisness.

  All I am saying is that, starting your own buisness is hard, but you can’t start a buisness because you see that industry booming, you have to have some sort of passion for it. Maybe people here that are going to sell their store or not making well, it could be the Gaming industry isnt for you maybe you would be able to make money in opening something else.

• sean
  Aug 29, 2008 at 12:05 pm

  Neil:
  I think you make some great points.

  Unfortunately, some franchisors specifically target people with no industry experience, citing the “no bad habits to unlearn” rationale which is true only in very specific cases. More often it’s that people with industry experience aren’t willing to pay for the smoke and mirrors. I’m not saying this in reference to PnT because I don’t know. I get good and bad comments on them.

  An example is the eBay Drop off store concept. For the most part, if someone had eBay experience they’d have known that they could get the same training without all the baggage and fees directly from eBay. They also would know that a storefront is a bad idea, as is being completely dependent on eBay. So those with eBay experience would not buy, and those who bought lacked experience and relied on the franchisor to be fair and honest. In the case of iSold It and Snappy Auctions, an expensive mistake.
  But gaming is a nuanced market - like video rentals was - and it is important for people to know the dynamics, quirks and true nature of the business they’re entering. Back in the video heyday and probably still, money wasn’t made simply getting people through the door - it was all about inventory control - buying the right amount of the hits at the right time and selling them off at the right time. You’re selling perishable goods - like buying unripe fruit in the hopes of selling them at the perfect time for the highest price. You can’t get left holding them past expiration or you’ll lose on every sale.

• Joe B
  Aug 29, 2008 at 1:54 pm

  I apologize ahead of time for the long post. 

  I’ve been tracking this discussion for awhile and have found it very interesting. I’m looking into purchasing a PNT store and feel that most of the complaints about the company are a result of franchisees that may not know exactly what they were getting into when they started. I may (and probably am for many) be wrong on this, but it’s the sense I get.

  I’ve called a few store owners to get feedback, and they say basically what people here have complained about - long hours, low pay (in the beginning), corporate won’t do everything for you, etc. It’s your “baby” and you need to work at it.

  I’ve also been concerned about the discussion regarding the future of the gaming industry (going downloadable and all that). There is still such a digital divide out there and the high-speed internet is not available to everyone (and won’t be for awhile). I just read about TimeWarner limiting customer’s bandwidth too. I think people will buying discs for a long time to come (whether new or retro).

  My biggest concern with starting a PNT now is (and Neil points this out), who would want to get into retail in these economic times? I read everywhere that the video game industry fairs OK through times like this, but can that last? Will people still send discretionary income on games? That’s my worry and the biggest reason I’ve hesitated so far.

  Neil, you said you talked to a PNT owner looking to sell. Can you share where you’re from? I don’t have a lot of retail experience and would be interested in talking to the owner about his/her experience with retail.

  Please keep this entire discussion going … it’s been very helpful.

• Nathan
  Aug 29, 2008 at 2:06 pm

  I SEE SOME OF U ARE REALLY SLAPIN EACH OTHER IN THE FACE OVER THIS SUBJECT BUT PNT IS AWSOME ITS THE ONLY STORE I SHOP AT FOR GAMES

• sean
  Aug 29, 2008 at 4:54 pm

  Joe B wrote: …most of the complaints about the company are a result of franchisees that may not know exactly what they were getting into when they started.
  Joe, that’s not just the case with PnT, but with many, if not most, franchisee unhappiness. Both sides can be at fault for unrealistic expectations, and in the end both sides suffer when there’s a disconnect.
  On the Franchisor side, commissioned salespeople often want to close a sale even if a franchisees expectations are unrealistic. On the franchisee side, people will wire tens of thousands of dollars to strangers, and invest half a million, but would never consider taking a job at one of the places for a month to see if they hate it or get a sense of whether it works.

  Your statement about the future of gaming smacks of what’s called “confirmation bias,” looking for ways to justify a positive decision rather than objectively analyzing the risks. If I knew that big changes were likely to be coming down the road, I would look very hard at the franchisor to see if they are tuned in to the threats and working on ways to adapt to changes in the industry. They should already be working on it.

• JR
  Aug 30, 2008 at 12:39 am

  I’m presently looking into a PnT franchise opportunity. One was just open around where I live and they seem to be doing well as I always see many customers everytime I visit the store.

  Do any of you know what could possibly be the profit margin on both new and used video games?…What should be the minimun monthly sales volume for a store to be profitable?…

  Best regards to everyone and thanks in advance for your input!

• Dan
  Sep 9, 2008 at 7:57 am

  Anyone who knows anything about the video game industry knows that money is not now nor ever has been in selling systems. Microsoft and Sony have both admitted significant losses in getting systems into the market because they make more on selling the games. They are going for an installation base. It is the sign up for XYZ cellular service and we will give you a free phone because they wil re-coop the costs over the terms of the contract agreement.

  So to look at investing in a Play and Trade with the expectations of making money on new games is systems is flawed from the beginning. Play and Trade is set up much like a “Dirt Lot” used car dealership … the margins on used games is huge! Considering you can buy a used copy of GTA 4 from a customer for $20 and sell it for $50. That is the model! Tie in the fact that they are the only store that clean scratched games, allow you to play before you buy and, in my market, buy used cell phones and iPods, and you have multiple revenue streams.

  Now, if you are a gamer, like myself, you need to look at Gamestop, who is the only true competitor, and ask “what are they not offering that I as a gamer want?” and it comes down to extras that you as a PnT franchisee can provide. Video game related toys, t-shirts, posters, swag, imports and you begin to offer something different that the mega store does not offer. Also, on top of the tournaments offer game saves, information on new games and release dates … become a freaking resource!! The Gamestops in my area are filled with employees that know nothing about any of this stuff other than what they have on their dry erase boards.

  Let’s also not forget about marketing … there are soooo many affordabe ways to market to young males that it makes my head spin. Play and Trade is an excellent opportunity if you are a gamer who is passionate about gaming.

  Finally, downloadable game will not be a realistic reason to fear this industry for quite some time. Bandwith has already been discussed and because you and I may have it the national average for high speed (DSL is NOT high speed ATM) is only about 28-30%! Add to that the fact that no current gen system has enough storage space to hold all of the games, movies and shows. This too will change but what will not change is the fact that over 80% of gamers want the disc. If something happens to their system or storage device they want a backup.

  I am rambling and don’t have time for spell check so I apologize for my ramblings. But, I do want it to be known that from what I can tell those who are complaining are not gamers and don’t know how to reach out to gamers. Play and Trade, regardless of the earlier posters thesis, is a viable model if done correctly. Just don’t go into it thinking your bread and butter is going to be coming from new games and systems … that is not the PnT model no matter what you thought you heard from corporate and those who know nothing about this industry!

• Jason
  Sep 22, 2008 at 6:30 pm

  I would like to throw out a few thoughts here. Niel stated that a owner, who was trying to sell him his store, stated that he “hated retail”. If I was trying to sell you junk I would not volunteer that it was junk but rather I would tell you whatever I thought you needed to hear in order to complete the sale. Another person said that it requires work and commitment to make the business work. I LIVED at my store, period! Since I did not have experience owning a business I followed my training to the letter and at the end of the day it did not work FOR ME! Matt stated that if a person wants to do some real research they should contact some of the 140 owners and get their thoughts. I would like to ask why do you not share the names and numbers of store owners that did not make it? When my store was open I was contacted daily by potential franchisee’s once I closed the store my phone has not rung once, and yes, my phone number at my new APARTMENT is the same as it WAS at my HOME.

• sean
  Sep 23, 2008 at 1:49 am

  Matt wrote: Matt stated that if a person wants to do some real research they should contact some of the 140 owners and get their thoughts. I would like to ask why do you not share the names and numbers of store owners that did not make it? When my store was open I was contacted daily by potential franchisee’s once I closed the store my phone has not rung once…
  Before one purchases any franchise they should contact the closed, terminated franchisees and those who “transferred” their stores (which could mean sold at a substantial loss). Franchisors are required to list those franchisees - as well as all current ones - in the Franchise Disclosure Document furnished to all serious prospects.

  Here are the latest lists for Play N Trade:
  
  Play N Trade Terminated Franchisees (pdf)

  
  Play N Trade Active Franchisees (pdf)

  These lists can be dated, and the contact info can be (intentionally or not) out of date, but it’s a start. Be diligent in your due diligence.

• sean
  Sep 23, 2008 at 2:16 am

  Franchisees of Play N Trade Stores Closed/Terminated 2007

  Henry Mangio, Kennesaw, GA (Terminated)
  Don Kendall, Castle Rock, CO (Sold. Debranded?)
  May & Naytyn Lui, San Jose, CA (Closed)
  Gary & Carla LaPierre, Fernandina Beach, FL (Closed)
  Jeremy & Mona Caneso Bantolina, Mililani, HI (Closed)
  Ahmed Jarrar, Germantown, MD (Closed)
  Jeff & Becky Drewlo, Blaine, MN (Closed)

  Additionally, Scott Scharman transferred 5 units, and Brian Greshan and Daniel Chang each transferred a franchise to new franchisees.

  Does anyone know the circumstances of these closings?

• Paul
  Oct 6, 2008 at 1:24 pm

  Folks let first and foremost say that I’m not a franchisee or an expert on Play n’ Trade’s business model. I am simply a customer and a gamer and probably fall into a very desirable demographic for Play n’ Trade.

  I recently paid a visit to a local Play n’ Trade store here in Northern Virginia and to another store in Manchester, Mo while visiting some family.

  A few things struck me immediately about the stores. First and foremost was the absolute lack of stock. Literally the shelves were bare or stock spaced out to try and cover up the obvious lack of games. The new games section was devoid in both stores of most of the current new titles for major platforms like the XBox 360, PS3 or PS2. The used games section fared a bit better and had more choices but in both stores the prices were painfully out of touch with the going rate for titles at places like GameStop/EB Games or online retailers like EBay or Amazon.com.

  I’ve read many of the comments posted here concerning the “exploding video game market” and the profit margins of used games but if the stores don’t have games to buy how can they expect to turn a profit?

  Granted I understand that I’ve only visited 2 stores, is this atypical for the company?

  In my humble opinion the only way to compete with stores like GameStop/EB Games is to offer a better selection at a competitive price. I’ve been a gamer for most of my life - I’m 27 now - and can tell you that most of my buddies dislike GameStop/EB and would jump at the opportunity to support a new store; especially one that is locally owned.

  In my experience GameStop/EB Games have some major shortcomings. One, the stores are not every very well organized. Games are littered all over the store and it’s a hunt to find a particular used title. Two, the stores are staffed by disinterested teens (usually) who are terrible at customer service. Three, more times than not employees of a GS/EB will insert their own bias or fanboyism into a transaction. I can’t buy a game for the PS3 without getting a comment about how, “it’s better on the X360″ or visa-versa. Four, GS/EB will not let you try a new game before buying it & the kiosk games are usually not new titles or the kiosks are broken altogether. Lastly and probably most importantly, most gamers get a sense that GS/EB Games are ripping them off. Of course that stems from GS/EB buying a used game for $20 (or less) and reselling it for $54.99.

  After visiting the Play n’ Trade stores I really am pulling for you owners out there. I hope that your stores succeed and I hope that I can walk into one of your stores someday soon and purchase the games I want and maybe talk to another gamer and discover a new game or two. Good luck and I hope that some of you find my post helpful.

Have an opinion? Leave a comment:

• Use this area to discover new blogs and content in the b5media network.
• Beauty & Style
• Business
• Entertainment
• General
• Health & Wellness
• Lifestyles
• Music
• Sports
• Team Blogs
• Technology
• Travel & Culture